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Trying to Understand Liberal Morality

Posted Sunday, March 14, 2010, at 2:25 PM

(Photo)
More gun control talk is coming up around the country from leftist politicians. This is natural, as more and more we become the new Soviet state, the government will naturally try and disarm us.

Please dear Liberals, explain your morality.

Explain to us how a woman found dead in an alley, raped and murdered with her own panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman who has to explain to Police how the would-be attacker ended up with a bullet hole in his head.

Explain to us how an elderly couple, whose home is invaded, as they are beaten and robbed, perhaps killed, are morally superior to a grandma who shoots the invaders with her shotgun.

Liberalism never makes sense, but they try don't they?

Right now, Obama and his fellow Communists, Socialists, Marxists, Statists and Liberal thugs (CSMSL's) are out there talking about the seventy people who die in America, every day they say, because they don't have health insurance.

Please dear Liberals, explain your morality.

How is it you are so very concerned about the alledged seventy folks who supposedly die each day because we don't have Obamacare, yet you show little or no concern, or just make lame excuses for the THREE THOUSAND babies that are slaughtered each day by abortionists?

Explain how your morality works, dear Liberals.

Bart Stupak, a Democrat Michigan Congressman, who at least for the moment, is showing more backbone and courage than our own Senator Ben (dover) Nelson, said recently that Liberals WANT abortion funding because babies are just to damned expensive.

Quoting Stupak, "If you pass the Stupak amendment, more children will be born, and therefore it will cost us millions more. That's one of the arguments I've been hearing." Stupak further says, "Money is their hang-up. Is this how we now value life in America? If money is the issue - come on, we can find room in the budget. This is life we're talking about."

Bart! Buddy! These are Liberals (CSMSL's) we are talking about!

Hello!

Of course they value money more than life. Duh!

Liberals (CSMSL's) can find millions for Pelosi's mouse, or billions for Union thug payoffs. They have already wasted trillions of dollars...I could go on with page after page outlining the reckless spending, bribes and payoffs, but money for babies?

Have you had an epiphany Bart?

Oh I know, Liberals (CSMSL's) always claim that, individually, they are against abortion, but actions speak louder than words. They do want abortion, they just don't have the backbone to admit it. Perhaps it is because Liberals think that everyone is as dense as they, so it is politically expedient to claim you are against killing kids, all the while working to that gruesome end.

Liberals have long expressed their distress that Islamic terrorists and killers are being incarcerated at GITMO, To a Liberal, Islamic murderers deserve to be honored with rights from our Constitution, but they call for no rights for those innocent human beings in the womb of their mothers.

Explain to us, dear Liberals, your morality.

Liberals (CSMSL's) constantly rail against business in this country. Many of the crazy leftists, while claiming to be highly intelligent, do not know the difference between profit and greed. So they attack the profits of the producers, and ignore the greed of leftists in government employee unions, government programs, college professors, and leftist politicians.

To leftists, money is only evil when they don't have it, or control of it. Obama has all but shut down Las Vegas, with his ignorance and elite stupidity, but he has no problem with folks wasting money to attend the Dopenhagen leftist religious festival.

It was Nancy Pelosi, who opined: "Think of an economy where people could be an artist or a photographer or a writer without worrying about keeping their day job in order to have health insurance."

So let me understand. You want to rob producers like electricians, bricklayers, waitresses, hardware store owners, plumbers, farmers, ranchers, carpenters, etc., to be able to make sure that folks can paint or take pictures. I am sure this makes sense in San Fransisco.

One of my four brothers is an artist and a musician. He is one of these guys that can play any instrument, and a very talented artist. I cannot recall in the fifty years I've known the guy, that he ever complained that a lack of insurance held him back with his talent.

But then again, he never stuck a crucifix in a jar of urine and called it art either. Is this the kind of thing Pelosi envisions? Thousands of San Fransisco wack-a-doos, painting pictures of Christ as a homosexual? I've seen pictures of what the homosexuals in San Fransisco call art. Jesus dildo's and Virgin Mary butt plugs.

Explain your morality Liberals.

I know some of you get irritated, (you've said as much) at me for talking about abortion as frequently as I do.

I have to ask you, why is abortion, why is the murder of the unborn, so important to you?

It must be important to you, you support it, vote for it, defend it, and support those who will see to it that the abortion holocaust continues. Why do you struggle to be truthful with us?

You Liberals (CSMSL's) could have your Soviet style health care right now, if abortion were not so important to you.

Nancy Pelosi says the argument is not about abortion. Oh yes it is. So important are the deaths of innocents to the leftists, that Pelosi and the rest of the nut-case libs, are willing to risk their entire health care assault upon America...for abortion.

I think Stupak will eventually give in to the Stalin-like tactics of Pelosi, Obama, and Immanuel. If he proves me wrong, I will publicly apologize, however, all one has to do is look at Ben (dover) Nelson. Senator Nelson claims to be pro-life, but sold out for Union payoffs and Medicare. I contend that not one baby has been saved due the political efforts of the phony pro-lifer Ben (dover) Nelson.

That is because to a goofy Liberal, unions and massive government are more important than babies and they prove that every day. Folks, what do the Liberals have to do? Hit you in the head with an aborted fetus before you get the picture?

In the days to come, with health care rationing, phony Liberal morality will come into play as the elderly are rationed to an early grave.

Maybe you will finally see that words "Liberal" and "morality" are not able to function together. I just wonder how many more folks have to die, or be robbed of their labor and treasure, before many of you wake up.


Comments
Showing comments in chronological order
[Show most recent comments first]

Carl the faker!

Have you repented yet? Before I answer your question, will you at least try to be honest and admit that you are not a Christian and never have been one?

LOL - That's okay faker-Carl, truth and courage would be the last things I'd expect from you.

Ah -let's see, I guess I could start with the Emeryville City Council (California there Carl) on Tuesday March 11th / decided to consider a proposed ordinance that would restrict the sales of firearms and ammunition.

I'm not giving you the links faker-Carl, you look it up.

The State of Maryland has severe financial problems (as do most liberal strongholds) and instead of dealing with real problems, a Democrat State Senator, Brian Frosh, wants gun registration laws. Liberal Frosh calls it the Firearm Safety Act of 2010, but what it should be called is the "protect criminals act of 2010". Again to faker-Carl, take time to look it up.

In Maine, the Legislature just tabled a proposal to allow Police to confiscate weapons without due process. You'd love that wouldn't you faker-Carl?

In Chicago, Obama mentor Mayor Richard Daley, on March 9th (of this year faker-Carl) called for NEW LAWS TO RESTRICT GUN SALES. Daley does it every year, as he dreams of an America where Chicago thug politicians can run amok.

Put down your copy of Obama's books, and try doing some actual research faker-Carl.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Sun, Mar 14, 2010, at 8:18 PM

Home run Sam. You're right about Carl too.

Hubby and I see attempts at gun control all the time around the country. It never ends. Hubby wanted me to be sure and tell you that various states are considering conceal carry laws. We may be seeing a re-birth of State Rights in the face of Obama-government tyranny. I hope you are wrong about Stupak. It would be nice to see one Democratic member of Congress with a spine. Stupak will probably end up in a room full of union bosses who will make him an offer he can't refuse.

-- Posted by CandyKilroy on Sun, Mar 14, 2010, at 8:32 PM

Hi Candy. Haven't heard from you and hubby in a while. (I know, I know, you have a life! LOL)

Oh you know that union bosses have bent Stupak's ears. One can only imagine the heat he is getting. I want to be optimistic about Bart Stupak, but we have the glaring betrayal of Ben (dover) Nelson fresh on our minds.

I hope you're right about States asserting themselves in the face of a runaway federal government. The problem with asserting states rights nowadays is the fact that states are ever so willing and eager to get money from the feds to fund their ill-conceived liberalism.

Thanks Candy.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Sun, Mar 14, 2010, at 8:39 PM

I was not reading or commenting for a while becuase my old computer crashed and burned. I ordered a new computer, and it took them forever to get it to me. I was re-reading this blog when it hit me what you said. Liberals would have their precious health care takeover if abortion was not so crucial to them. In the end, if abortion is included, and it most likely will be, that one fact alone may give millions of us the right to be conscientious objectors.

-- Posted by CandyKilroy on Sun, Mar 14, 2010, at 8:58 PM

Candy - I agree that we could object to participate in new taxation and health care laws on a conscientious grounds.

But, I have to say, Liberals would gladly throw us in jail, and build new jails, with glee! If enough people were to refuse to fill out tax forms, or participate in government health care, maybe we could prevail. But not before Liberals would destroy as many lives as possible.

I have seen a real lack of resolve on the part of Conservatives and Christians. We have not stood up to the government for decades now. We have let the Liberals run crazy. Conservatives want to just be left alone, they try and live as the Apostle Paul said; "As much as it be within you, live a quiet and peaceable life."

Perhaps with the Liberals (CSMSL's) over-reaching, maybe conservatives will finally come to realize that we must stand for our country, or lose our country.

Thanks again Candy - God Bless.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Sun, Mar 14, 2010, at 9:20 PM

Sam,

There is your answer from Guillermo, Liberals lack defined morality.

That said...your whole theme of this rant is unclear to me. You begin with vague threats of "they're coming to take my guns" then rail about abortion connecting strains to abortion with such weak arguments that leave one little recourse but to discount your arguments.

Carl asked for some links and so you callously insult him and tell him you are too important to have to provide documentation to support your claims?

Were your examples of raped and murdered people from some other story you heard or are they creations of your fantasy? I've never heard a Liberal say that it is more moral to be raped or murdered than to defend yourself. When did you?

Please dear Sam, explain your morality,

Why is it that you stand up for thousands of aborted fetuses but not for the alledged [sic]seventy who die each day from lack of healthcare. Is it that your morality is based on scale?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 9:46 AM

Senior,

With your obviously superior mathemagical skills, can you provide me with a number that our population should be so that we can "manage" it?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 9:50 AM

Senior,

I am not interested in what you believe the radical right would want for the population, I am interested in what YOU think. You make the claim that we cannont "handle" 50 million more people as we cannot "manage the number we now have. What do you think would be the appropriate number to manage?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 10:12 AM

Senior,

Here is your post I was questioning:

"Truth is, not one bot has yet tried to imagine, or discuss, how we would be handling an extra 50,000,000 in our population when we can't come close to managing the roughly 305,000,000 we have right now. I know the processors are outdated and frankly, decrepit, but I thought there were at least some rudimentary math abilities there."

I failed to see the question you put forth perhaps you can point it out to me?

I inferred from your post that you feel we would not be able to support another 50,000,000 if I am incorrect I apologize. Because I inferred this, I wondered what you would feel an appropriate population would be when I asked you failed to answer originally, now you have that there should be no limit on population (if I understand your thunderdome comment correctly) I do not think it is governments role to "manage" or "handle" the population it appears you do.

Unlike you I do not like abortion, but at least you have the courage to admit to something Sam and most of the right wingers have been accusing Liberals of for years that they are not pro-choice but rather pro-abortion. I see abortion as a necessary evil in some cases but not as a general method of birth control. Your pro-abortion stance and idea of government "management" of the population would lead not to Thunderdome, (although I would believe we would be living beyond Thunderdome not in Thunderdome itself) but rather to a Logan's Run. Perhaps because of the overpopulation you see we will soon be enjoying Soylent Green? (We could do this all day to little avail)

I don't believe the numbers Sam quotes regularly with the 50,000,000 abortions would lead to 50,000,000 more people in the country. Surely some would have been miscarried naturally or died of other causes in the time since Roe V. Wade. What I most disagree with is the reasoning that these extra people would put undue strains on society. That is the general argument I infer from your comment, is this correct? If that is the argument, should we not avail ourselves of similar methods to control those who are putting strain now. This surplus population argument is the argument of many Congressional Democrats including Pelosi, interesteingly this is also the argument of Ebenezer Scrooge.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 11:10 AM

Senior,

One point of contention:

I didn't assign your beliefs to anyone other than you. If you read carefully you may notice that I didn't include anyone else in the discussion. I merely stated that Sam and other right wingers have been making assertions about Liberals that you admitted to. I did include you with those Liberals, I didn't include those Liberals with your specific comments. Of all the posters here I believe that I do among the LEAST generalization and try to address specific comments.

reformedrightwinger,

I agree I was hoping Sam would be so kind as to explain that to me as well. Apparently he is no longer reading or only likes to reply to his chosen few.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 11:57 AM

Joe,

Hilarious! I'm glad you recognize that your attempts at humor are feeble.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 12:15 PM

reformedrightwinger,

I'm a little disappointed you feel the need to stoop to that level of "argument" I had thought better of you. Even though you disagree with Joe, there is no need to mock.

In this case I can sift through the muck which is most of what Joe says to find the grain of truth. Elimination of the undesirables was a main tennant of the Nazi structure as well as in other totalitarian regimes. As was the forced sterilization which occured in this country well into the last century. Senior Loud calls for big government with near total control, it is not impossible these things could come again.

Guillermo,

One could argue a great many things. If the destruction of criminals before they are able to commit crimes works so well to reduce crime rates, could an argument not be made that those who commit crimes should be sterilized so they can't produce future criminals? While we are at it perhaps we should just execute all criminals thus saving the cost of incarceration and rehabilitation programs.

This line of reasoning seems to me to be a "when do the ends justify the means" argument.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 1:06 PM

reformedrightwinger,

Generally falling into the Hitler argument is exactly what you say, but not everytime, that is why its important to speak about specifics not generalities. In this case, (one of the few that I've seen) Joe actually had a legitimate point that could be directly tied to Hitler's tactics.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 1:33 PM

Senior Loud,

You are right I do try to moderate debate, I would like to see some actual debate not the histrionics that so often encompasses this site. If that makes me a wuss, so be it. I see not point in the witless namecalling and blather. I do understand that you find it fun which to me says a great deal about your developmental level. For all of the immature people like you and Joe I always hold out hope for some who are worthy of talking with. If you prefer I will stop addressing you.

ball_o_fire,

Although I would not classify myself as a Con-Bot I would try to answer your question. Abortion is not illegal so no crime is commited. Were it to be made illegal, I'm sure the purveyors and participants of illegal abortions would have to face punitive actions. As you may be aware there are varying degrees of consequence for different crimes.

Perhaps you can now answer a question for me. If killing a fetus is not a crime, why then are those people who kill pregnant women charged with two murders in some states?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 2:04 PM

Senior,

How can an out-dated con-bot like myself possibly debate your greatness? I'm a little confused. Maybe we are using different definitions of "debate." Mocking others, devising "clever" names, creating fantasies are not what I would call debate. I do criticize people based on what they say and I will use their words to show what they have said. I don't generalize vast swathes of society based on what a few people around here say. I don't call names nor do I ascribe motives and beliefs to people other than those to which they show. When I am wrong I apologize and try to rectify the situation.

I'm glad you have the courage to "dare[d] to write many different thoughts, in spite of knowing that the "immature people like you [me] and Joe" would give me heck." It certainly takes a great deal of courage to log on and tell people they have no understanding of anything and are mindless automotons, rather than people who have different opinions than yours.

You say I don't debate and perhaps you are sadly correct. It is pretty hard to debate when you are the only one talking reasonably. I have on occasions had decent debates here, though not as often as I'd like. I will gladly debate any issue you choose. Suggest one, make a point and I will respond. Please consider when making your point to leave off name calling and fantasy.

You are also correct that I at time joke and tease, perhaps it is a matter of semantics but the occasional jokes I indulge in for brief amusement and tension relief not the basis of all of my arguments.

Speaking honestly how, other than side of the political spectrum do you differentiate between your writings and the writings of Joe?

ball_o_fire

The point is moot since abortion will never be criminalized but as a judge I would have to take each case on an individual basis. Just as killing an adult has different circumstances and different penalties.

I asked the question about murder of pregnant women because it appears to me to be the opposite of this situation. Would you argue that if abortion were illegal, those who got them should be charged with murder just as the person who murders a pregnant woman is?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 3:01 PM

Guillermo,

I apologize I didn't fully flesh out my thinking when I typed that. I realize that there would be more social programs etc. to support those extra people. But that is like saying I am not a burden on society. We all are part of the problems in the world. I should have included that the fact that they would "burden" society is no reason for them not to exist. Would the fact that they would be a "burden" on society be enough reason for them to not exist? This argument seems to be made by some Liberals when abortion is discusses. I do not think so.

ball_o_fire,

Very well, I would not believe any judge would sentence a woman to death for getting an illegal abortion, nor do I think they should. I would imagine a probationary sentence of 2-5 years with pregnancy prevention training would be appropriate. Keep in mind that is just my opinion I can't speak for any Conservatives here.

Senior,

Style of writing, or lack as you put it, is only one thing that sets us apart. Do you feel my disagreement with some propositions is insulting or mocking? It has never occured to me that not everyone thinks as I do, thank you for pointing it out. I have never denied I am arrogant. I'm sorry that I'm not funny arrogant, do you consider yourself funny arrogant or funny modest?

We'd better get one thing straight: do you honestly believe those you style con-bots are in fact not human and are indeed robotic organisms? That is what I style fantasy not your arguments, except when those arguments are based on that fantasy.

I have tried to refrain from calling you anything other than what you claim to be although you have called me con-bot and conservative although I would not classify myself as either, is this not arrogance?

I'm not particularly sorry we can't be friends. I think I could be friends with Guillermo if we ever met but I fear you are correct.

Still waiting for debate topic.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 3:50 PM

I can always tell when you hit the mark Sam ole boy, these liberals go nuts. Of course, as Candy said, "home run."

You liberals hate it when Sam hits you with the consequences of your beliefs. I've said it before, and I will say it again, Sam gives you liberals the rope, and you run to hang yourselves.

Sam was right to call Carl a phony or (fake) because he is. Carl, your little hit using Sam's wife was typical for liberals who get caught in their own webs. Sam merely asked you to be honest about your faith. You claim to be a God-fearing man, and yet we both know you're not.

You liberals will have to answer for your coldheartedness towards the unborn, and I can see that really bugs you. I'd hate to be in your shoes when the time comes to explain your cold heart to the Almighty. I don't think God will take your liberal double talk.

Sam's point that you would have your precious health care takeover disaster TODAY if it where not for liberals demanding that abortion be covered, was glossed over by the usual liberal hate mongers.

Sam, we've never met, but I want to tell you how much I appreciate you and pray for you. These liberals would cut your heart out in a second, and I pray for your well being. Keep speaking out Sam, that's all we can do. I have been battling hard not to lay off employees, so pray for me. I have not had a paycheck in almost a year, but I have not had to fire anyone. If the health care disaster passes, then I think I'll be out of business, but that is what Obama wants, right? Just kill small business, and soon we all will be government dependents.

When I first starting reading your blogs, I thought you were too hard on liberals, suggesting that their motivation was a basically hatred. I thought that they were just ignorant and brainwashed, but seeing the continued comments from those on the left, I have come to see the light. Hate pours from these liberals like water from a fire hose. Watch your backside my friend.

-- Posted by Leo.Pold on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 4:17 PM

Leo - Thanks for your comments. I can only imagine what you're going through with your business. I just have one employee, ME, and I have a real fight on my hands to stay in business.

I see the devastation caused by this horrid Obama Administration from Seattle to Georgia, from San Antonio to Michigan. I'm sure that the Lord will be with you as you struggle to keep your employees. God honors that kind of effort Leo, don't ever stop trusting God. Dufus libs like Guillermo, have no idea what true sacrifice is, he thinks volunteering at a soup kitchen is the answer. GI has no idea of what the real world is like.

I am not really worried about these libs hurting me physically, because liberalism is a gutless choice. If libs had any fortitude, they wouldn't be libs. Besides, if a lib were to kill me, he'd just do me a favor.

You don't have to be a psychic to understand the likes of people like Carl. It is a typical leftist tactic on blogs, to pretend to be a Christian so that they can scold actual Christians into submission. Carl resorts to low-blows when you tag him with reality. When an elderly woman, Gertrude was her name, posted a comment that she was no longer a Democrat, it was Carl who called her a phony. Her son, Backgammon I think, said he'd like to meet Carl and let the faker-Carl call his mother a phony to his face. Of course, the libs took that as threat, or at least pretended to.

So when Carl tries to drag my wife into the argument, he exposes his vacant heart, his empty mind, and his gutlessness.

Carl is just following along after his real god, Obama. Remember when Obama said in an interview on ABC with Stephanopoulos, "my Muslim faith." George had to correct him, "you mean your Christian faith, right?" I've known Christians all my life. Never, never, never, have I ever heard a Christian man or woman or child, ever accidentally say they were Muslim, or Jewish.

Leo, I appreciate your prayers, I really do. I confess that I struggle to keep the faith as far as our country is concerned. Inside, I feel like liberals have already destroyed this country, and I wonder if America can recover from the leftist onslaught. This is where I get angry at fellow Christians. We really dropped the ball. We let stooges like Carl intimidate us, and we sit in our Churches, sing "Glory Hallelujah" and watch the libs destroy the country and kill millions of innocents.

I have even thought of ending my blog, to focus completely on how to stay afloat in the face of liberal Democrat oppression and government abuse. That is why I so much appreciate your prayers.

None of these mouthy liberal know-it-alls will be around when the outhouse goes up in flames. They will run and hide, and won't be available to answer for their part in the destruction of this once great nation. People like Guillermo live for the destruction of the USA because he hates you, he hates me, he hates America.

Leo - I am curious - what do your employees think? Do they understand your struggle to keep them working?

Always glad to hear from you Leo. I am stuck in Seattle tonight, with a bunch of other drivers who find themselves with no loads. The guy parked next to me says his income has dropped by half since Obama and the left took power. Sounds about right, mine is down by almost that much, yet my taxes are going up - go figure.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 8:30 PM

Hey there Loud - By Golly, I am going to grant you your point. You are absolutely correct. There are many phony politicians in the Republican Party. I call them Decept-a-cons.

You are right that they say they are pro-life, then do nothing to help end the abortion nightmare. You are also partially correct when you say that no Conservative politician ever did much to stop abortion either. There are some that have tried.

That brings us to Ben (dover) Nelson. He actually was in a power position to make a stand for the unborn. For whatever reason, Ben (dover) was at the right place, at the right time, to actually make a difference! And, he blew it, blew it big time, he embarrassed himself, the pro-life movement and the State of Nebraska. He chose political power over the lives of those precious children.

God grants few men such an opportunity. You see, libs love to pretend that these killings are inconsequential, and brother, America has paid, and will continue to pay for the abortion nightmare.

Am I saying that America is cursed because of abortion? Cursed is a strong word. I see the USA, with the abortion disaster, like a farmer who CHOOSES to plant crops in a drought, rather than plant crops in the abundant waters of God's Blessings.

Thanks Senor Loud for taking time to read and comment. God Bless.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 8:46 PM

Senior Loud - I read your other comment. I just want to make sure I understand what you are saying. Are you saying that Americans were right to kill these 50 million kids?

Maybe the reason we struggle to care for the citizens we have, is because today's American seems to care more for his-her own jollies, and has not stepped up to do the right thing by working for a better future for our offspring.

Guillermo, in his shattering ignorance, once said that abortion prevented rapists and murderers from being born. Are you going to follow along after sickening logic like that?

I'd be careful listening to Guillermo if I were you. His thoughts and words are robotic, most likely penned by some commie professor.

You bring up Rush's sins, with some cleverness I admit, but are you without sin? Have you never made a mistake or a stupid decision? Are only perfect people allowed to speak out?

I'd be careful about having a cavalier attitude regarding the deaths of so many innocent humans. One day, and that day may come sooner than later, you government will have the same cavalier attitude towards your life.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 8:57 PM

SW Nebr Transplant -

I would be glad to answer your question. I do not believe Obama and his minions when they claim that 70 people die every day because of a lack of insurance. If they are correct, and 70 people die everyday because of no insurance, then my friend, (hope you don't mind if I call you friend) how will sending seniors to an early grave help that? We save 70, but kill many more than that?

And listen up! No one is denied care in this country. if you have proof that right now, people with no insurance are denied care, I'd be interested in knowing about it.

On Christmas eve a few years ago, my wife and I were in Phoenix. My wife thought she was having a heart attack. We drove to the emergency room at the nearest hospital. The emergency room was packed with illegals and their kids. No one is denied care, and so you have to know that this 70 folks BS, is just that - BS.

Are you aware that Medicare denies more claims, as a direct percentage, than any insurance companies? Do you not see how our Social Security system gives benefits to many who should not get them, and denies benefits to many that deserve them?

So, I explain my morality by saying that rationing seniors to death in great numbers in not a good trade off to save the seventy, plus, socialized health care will lead to more baby killing, can you deny that?

Can you possibly defend the more than thirty abortion mills in the State of Washington alone? Do you want to try?

I know you don't care for me much, but I do appreciate you taking time to read and comment. Thank you.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 9:13 PM

Guillermo - Just because you claim liberals have no defined morality, that does not give you the right to ignore the killing of fifty million humans.

And you lie when you say liberals have no defined morality, where the hell did political correctness come from!!! LOL Liberals have stolen much liberty in the pursuit of liberal morality, you putz! You are such a tool, it is hard to even talk with you.

It is liberal morality that allows the government to steal money from producers and give to non-producers like you.

You libs have a morality alright, and it is a stench in the nostrils of God.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 9:20 PM

Reformed - I am trying to get to everyone's comments and questions, and I appreciate you being patient with me. Like I said, I am stranded in Seattle tonight, so I am taking time to answer as many folks as I can.

You will have to trust me, when I say that I am giving you the straight poop from my heart.

I did not notice a downturn in the economy until Pelosi and the Democrats took power in Congress in 2006. Still, we were hanging in there. After the Presidential election, then things got nasty. Businesses were not acting like they thought the economy would prosper under Obama.

There have been increases in Road Taxes, Federal Excise Taxes, (tires, batteries, parts, supplies), gasoline taxes, fines for minor offenses, and so forth. What I mean by fines for minor offenses is - well, like Wyoming for instance. They passed a law, that any big truck, that is ticketed for going more than five miles over the speed limit will have an additional $300 dollar fine (surcharge). Wow, would you like that?

Then tolls for almost every toll road have gone up dramatically in the past year. The other day, I had to pay $31 bucks to travel 104 miles in Indiana. It cost more than 120 bucks to drive from Albany New York to Buffalo. In Oklahoma, last month, I paid 40 bucks to drive a lousy two hundred miles.

These costs take a toll on drivers like me. When my truck blew an engine in December, I had my old truck engine rebuilt rather than upgrade to a newer truck because freight is down since January 2009, (depending on who you believe) by 25% - 40%.

Remember pal - it was Democrat Senator Blanche Lincoln who told Obama that no one in his administration had any idea of what it was like to be self employed.

Then there is the IRS and their stepped-up harrassment of almost anyone who is self-employed. I do not exaggerate. The IRS acts like I have committed a crime by daring to be self employed. There was an article on the Drudge Report yesterday, (I think it is still there) where IRS agents went to a car-wash owner to demand that he pay FOUR CENTS! I wish I were making this up.

Because of tougher "green" regulations, tires have gone up, and batteries, and parts, it goes on and on. Two years ago, I could buy two new steer tires for $600. Today, they cost $865. That is quite an increase, and it is due to government.

I know that you and I have battled, sometimes with malice, but I believe in your sincerity. I am not trying to tell everyone how to live, nor do I expect that everyone has to follow God, in the manner that I see fit.

But RRW, what happened to respect for life? Have we, as a society, become numb to the sheer numbers of lost humans? God Forbid. How can the Almighty grant us life and liberty when we so freely take that same life and liberty from the most defenseless of all humans?

Thanks for reading and commenting.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 10:02 PM

Sam, no one mentioned a number related to that '70,' but how about forty-six per day being murdered, with or without health insurance. So far, this year 3,445 have been murdered, and 12,338,600 have died from all causes, insured, or not. Americans are dying at the rate of about one per second, from what-ever cause. Which ones constitute the 70 that BHO recognizes?

We cannot afford to pay the health bill for the entire nation of citizens, and then include 20 to 30 million illegals. Our economy will not sustain.

-- Posted by Navyblue on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 10:12 PM

Two Questions:

>>> Find one bit of legally admissible evidence that Pres. Obama has restricted anyone's rights to own any type of gun.

{He did advocate the legalization of people keeping their handguns with them when entering national parks -- But naturally the blithering mob of fearmongerers doesn't recognize that expansion of freedom for legal gun owners.]

>>> The entire Health Reform Bills passed by both houses are available on the Internet.

Show me one word making the insurance plans or other benefits will be made available to illegal immigrants ---

OR WHERE IT SAYS that public funds will every pay for any abortions.

This administration has not restricted one citizen's rights to own and carry a firearm.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 10:49 PM

Ball-0-fire:

I'd be glad to tackle your question regarding how to treat abortion.

When my youngest son (youngest of five kids) was twenty one, he screwed up. He gave a beer to an eighteen year old. The minor's parents found out, and my son spent two weeks in county jail. He also paid a fine of I think $300.

After he returned from serving overseas in the Navy, I asked him if he ever gave any alcohol to anyone under age again. He replied with a sterned faced "NO!"

Having said that, let me delve into this most sticky of issues.

Let's say, I have my way, and Abortion is outlawed except for rape, incest or life of the mother issues.

Even though I firmly believe that it is wrong to execute a baby for the crimes of his/her father, I could not ever tell a raped woman that she has to keep that baby. I would work to help her find a home for the child, however, no penalty should exist for such cases. The sheer brutality of the situation would demand understanding.

These instances, rape, incest and life of mother issues account for less than one tenth of one percent of all abortions. These figures were increased a bit by folks like George Tiller and Warren Hern, both who performed abortions like they were driven to kill kids. They'd claim almost every late term baby killing was due to rape or incest of life issues.

Now, let's deal with the rest.

If we, as a society, can stick a 21 year old man in jail for two weeks and fine him $300 bucks for giving a beer to a minor, then we should be able to do the same to a woman who has an abortion for reasons other than the above. (By the way, I was in favor of my son going to jail for two weeks for this act of dumbness)

Two of my children were girls. I had to give written permission for my daughters to get their ears pierced when they were under eighteen, yet, they can get an abortion at almost any age, and I can be kept out of the loop. Doesn't that seem odd to you?

Doctors who perform illegals abortions should be fined, and if they persist, well, then jail awaits. Would not the fines and penalties for my son giving beer to a minor increase if he would have continued in the bad behavior? Sure they would, and they should. Why would we treat the taking of a human life, the stoppage of a human heart, with less vigor than a beer violation?

Perhaps we could designate certain doctors to perform abortions, but under strict rules and guidelines, and proper monitoring.

I don't want to get too long winded with this, but at this point, I must ask an obvious question. What the hell is going on with American women, needing so many abortions every day? Have they not, in this enlightened society, figured out why they get pregnant?

C'mon gals, grow a brain. And you men, start acting like men. If you father a child, then man up for crying out loud. Fines and penalties should be harsh for men who father children, and run out on their responsibilities.

Let tackle some hard examples. Could the mother of a sixteen year old girl, who becomes pregnant, demand or insist that her daughter carry a baby to full term?

Well, that is a tough one. I'd say no. However, if you have an abortion, you go to jail for two weeks, you pay a fine, you attend classes on responsible behavior. Don't we treat drunk drivers in this manner?

If you have another abortion, you face harsher penalties or fines. You stigmatize the behavior, and let it be known that human life is precious.

What about a woman who is taking birth control and still gets pregnant? If you are in an argument with a person, and they strike you, are you allowed to kill them? Of course not, unless your life is truly in danger.

I think allowances can be made for a woman who is taking birth control and still gets pregnant. Perhaps a woman could be given certain tax allowances, and other incentives to have the baby, or even offer the child for adoption.

The government is always looking for ways to use the tax code to modify behavior, why can't it be done when a human life is at stake?

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 11:14 PM

Ball-o-fire:

Sorry, I added the above comment before I was finished. I want to talk about men/boys who father children that end up in the abortionists sink.

If the girl can provide the name of the impregnator (is that a word? LOL) then he should share in the same fate as the mother. A couple of weeks in jail, some fines, etc. Also, he should have to pay for DNA or paternity tests should they be necessary.

Do you think a teenage boy, or young man might be a bit more careful if he went to jail for getting a young woman pregnant that ended in abortion? I think so. Why would we believe that we can regulate drinking, but they taking of human life, we cannot?

If a person doesn't believe that life begins at conception, with the myriad of evidence that exist to prove it, then that person is being ignorant on purpose.

I'd be more than happy to continue this discussion with you, and sincerly thank you for the question, and your time in reading and commenting. God Bless.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 11:26 PM

Reformed - What about the innocents killed during war?

What a great question. Wow. Boy that is a tough one. I don't want to evade this question, but, war is hell, and no sane person ever wants war, or enjoys war.

When Harry Truman okayed the dropping of two atomic bombs, were innocents killed? Sure, you'd have to say that there were innocents killed. However, by all accounts, tens of thousands of American soldiers would have died trying to invade the island of Japan. Look at the price in human blood to take Iwo Jima and Tarawa.

But we must be realistic here, there is no way that we can say that an 18 year old girl and her boyfriend, deemed old enough to vote, and other legal rights, get pregnant, and then have the baby killed; to be on equal footing with a civilian who is killed in time of war.

Because civilians are killed during war, that would somehow be justification for ending the life of an innocent baby?

War should be avoided because innocents are victims, and abortion should be avoided for the same reason.

If you'd like to discuss further, I'd be delighted. Thanks for a tough hard question. God Bless.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Mon, Mar 15, 2010, at 11:52 PM

I have been reading your answers to these guys Sam, and you have much more patience than I. I think you are spot on. I don't mind being called your cheerleader.

No Carl, I won't shut up. Your big answer to Sam was to say you peak in his windows? OMG, you're a pervert huh? Sam nailed you on the phony that you are, and I say:

Woohoooooo! Way to go Sam! Go Sam! Go Sam! Go Sam!

I hope you don't mind my cheerleading Sam. As you probably know, Hubby and I are drivers. We can confirm everything you've said. I will keep you in my prayers / and that goes for you too Leo. I don't know if I would have the stomach to go without pay for a long period of time to keep employees working. So I will cheer for Leo.

Go Leo! Keep the faith! God loves you Leo!

I thought your answer to Balloffire was marvelous. Please keep at it, don't give up.

-- Posted by CandyKilroy on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 12:07 AM

Hey Candy - we should be cheering for Leo, especially since he is the type of guy Obama wants to destroy.

We should probably ignore Carl and Guillermo, but such ugliness is hard to ignore. Anyway, it is fun to expose liberals for their gross quackery.

You are appreciated Candy.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 1:01 AM

Guillermo - Your points were, of course, to be considered mostly to be part of the greater whole, but this is grossly oversimplified, and I want to share with you my utmost. Of course, people will say, and they should say, that all good things must, and you know it to be true. I will never try, and one should be careful, not to ever engage in that kind of, and I know you will. We should all try, and I insist, that we try, to be the best, and let no one take it from us. We need to be, and most assuredly be, correct when we discuss, and always be faithful. Thank you.

-- Posted by sameldridge on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 1:10 AM

"More gun control talk is coming up around the country from leftist politicians. This is natural, as more and more we become the new Soviet state, the government will naturally try and disarm us."

GEARJAMMER -- I check in with news sources in all 50 states routinely, as a business necessity.

Monitor all the major TV broadcast and cable/satellite news sources.

SAM -- THERE IS NO INCREASE IN GUN CONTROL TALK COMING FROM POLITICIANS.

The Old Reagan friends who have campaigned for gun control since Jim Brady was shot are still out there.

A number of groups; formed by people who are irritated by having to hit the floors in their homes when the assault rifle rounds start flying through windows and doors; are in business to raise awareness of their unhappiness.

A few politicians representing those folks-- or hoping to secure their votes -- are openly supporting them.

Those in Congress who have espoused gun control are being heard with less frequency.

The only people who are making much noise today, the NRA and "issues websites" attempting to raise money.

Having lived and grown with rifle, shotgun, horse, rope, vaccination gear, tattoo kit, branding iron and that small, sharp castrating blade on my knife -- I am not a rabid, raving gun control freak.

When I first witnessed four nutcases hunting deer with AK-47s and 30 & 40 round clips in Utah's Wasatch Range, I laughed.

But Sam, having hit the floor in an upper-middle class home in Monterey County, Calif. when Uzis and AK-47s opened up in a drug war, I see no reason for assault rifles, Thompson Sub-machine guns, RPGs and 30 round machine pistols in private hands.

Someone wants to hunt deer, antelope, "legal" bear, elk, moose, coyotes, caribou, musk-ox or tame bison -- there are hundreds of different bolt-action heavy-bore hunting rifles available.

Frankly, any hunter needing more than the first round to get a clean kill, is no hunter.

You recently objected to federal enforcement people being equipped with semi-auto 12 guage shotguns.

Local, state, federal law enforcement agents are daily facing violent criminals and mentally unstable people armed to the teeth with superior weapons to anything most lawmen are provided or can afford.

The Mexican border regions from Tijuana to Matamoras are being ripped apart by pitched battles between drug cartels, and 50-round murders of people the cartels don't like.

Three this week -- connected to a U.S. consulate or embassy.

A high percentage of the heavy-bore, high-rate-of-fire weapons being used in that drug war were imported into Mexico from the U.S.

The same channels used to haul drugs into the U.S. are being used to deliver guns, ammunition and explosives from the U.S. into Mexico.

Gearjammer, what will be your attitude if you pick up a high-value load of electronics or other manufactured goods and your conservative rump gets sprayed with a hundred rounds of teflon-coated slugs, while your rig and load depart.

I know drivers who refuse to haul for some shippers.

"Six rigs hauling loads from one shipper have been hi-jacked, and I'm not looking to die," is how one old-timer tells it.

Few years ago, a driver I dispatched with a load of swinging beef from south of Greeley, stopped for his break just east of St. Louis.

While he was in the shower, his rig went to Chicago. An Illinois state trooper found it with all reefer doors open, the compressor running, the tractor engine idling and no beef.

That trooper called in his find just off the freeway, before word of the hijacking reached his headquarters -- all in the same state.

In his sleeper, a half-dozen assault rifle cartridges.

Except for being able to grab the rig quietly, someone was prepared to play rough.

Boot Hill grave marker -- [Dumb stranger, took an Arkansas Toothpick to a gun fight].

How would you appreciate -- [Brave trucker, carried a handgun against four rifles loaded with 120 bullets].

Drive in peace, Sam. Just remember,that pistol is worthless against four assault rifles.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 4:19 AM

No one gets refused health care. correct? So in essence we are already paying for those without health care and illegal's. I say, since we are already paying for them we should insure them with a goernment health insurance plan. Navy blue says we cant afford it but it would seem to me that we are allready paying for it.

-- Posted by president obama on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 12:14 PM

GEARJAMMER,

Like it or not WE'RE PAYING FOR ALL THE PO'FOLKS' HEALTH CARE NOW IN THE MOST EXTREMELY INEFFICENT AND EXPENSIVE MANNER.

Public hospitals are jammed.

Every emergency room is jammed.

With low-income families who have no other place to go.

Actual trauma injuries are pushed aside if the injury is not life-threatening so the staff can clear the ER of coughing, vomiting, sneezing and bathroom monopolizing children.

Wait until you get broadsided by an unlicensed, untrained tour bus driver and have to take an ambulance ride to get stitched up --- and then sit for eight to ten hours waiting -- because you aren't in a life-threatening situation.

We need to establish a "Work-Fare" program,so people relying on public assistance must work in return. Janitoring public buildings, washing the city and county vehicles, maintaining parks, street plantings and cemeteries. Whatever, but if capable of work -- they work. No work-no cash.

How's that for a liberal approach?

Of course, Hubert Humphrey fought for it for decades and got shot down by Conservatives, because -- Hell, they didn't know why, just because HHH proposed it.

Which was another reason for me to leave my original party.

The real problem with the Conservative thought process --

'IF WE CAN'T HAVE 100% OF WHAT WE WANT, WE ARE GOING TO FIGHT AND OPPOSE ANYTHING ELSE.'

The GOP is like the fireman assigned to run the pumper, who wanted to climb the ladder with the pressurized hose.

The other firemen went up the ladder into the smoke and flames -- so this genius shut down the pumper.

"IF I CAN'T HAVE IT MY WAY. LET THE DAMN HOUSE BURN DOWN AND YOU GUYS WITH IT."

That's today's GOP and Conservative approach. Ike,Reagan, Poppa Bush, Nixon, Ford and DubYah

were unable to get anything accomplished with their own party, so they all had to rely on Democrats compromising and working with them.

There is no way to overstate the Democratic dislike for DubYah and the Draft Dodgers and DubYah's election-stealing brother.

But during DubYah's eight miserably bad years, the only way he was able to move any legislation through without totally catering to the NeoCons, was to work with the Democrats, who were willing to compromise -- where the GOP right wingers would not.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 2:29 PM

rrw

"Did you know that almost half of women who consider abortion didn't use protection in the month they got pregnant, mainly because they don't know it is available or how to use it?"

From what rabbits butt did you pull that statistic from? Do you honestly believe that? If the answer is yes, then you are living proof of the statement, "if you don't believe in God, you'll believe in anything".

My 8th grade daughter knew about sex and contraception since the 6th grade, from the school. We, her parents, taught her the difference between acting like animals and God inspired sex. Don't even bother quoting any studies of your above nonsense, people lie, they lie all the time about sex and "accidental pregnancies".

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 6:53 PM

Just ask!

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 7:59 PM

Find me a school, anywhere in the USA, that does not have a sex education class by the 8th grade.

And by the way, am I wrong?

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 8:30 PM

rrw,

Four year old data, very good. And after reading all that, I have to ask again. Am I wrong?

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 8:56 PM

I guess I did not realize we were only talking about abstinence only sex ed. I know I didn't bring it up. I could have swore we were talking about sex ed, contraception and the incidence of abortions. I take it as you have managed to change the subject entirely, you've lost the debate.

rrw,

Sorry, but yes I read it. It does make a compelling argument of the direct, yet imaginary, relationship between poverty and education. I however, cannot believe in this day and age, those who are capable of fertilization still cannot understand how conception occurs. And Guttmacher couldn't show why.

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 9:32 PM

rrw

"Did you know that almost half of women who consider abortion didn't use protection in the month they got pregnant, mainly because they don't know it is available or how to use it? We could eliminate a large number of abortions in the country simply by showing young (and mostly poor) women how to take a pill everyday or use a condom every time." Posted by reformedrightwinger on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 2:37 PM

Do you need further explaination?

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 10:23 PM

Check Mate.

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Tue, Mar 16, 2010, at 10:27 PM

"Did you know that almost half of women who consider abortion didn't use protection in the month they got pregnant, mainly because they don't know it is available or how to use it?"

Leaving aside the sex education rants, Chunky Peanut Butter did ask a valid question of where you got this information. Is it from the link you posted? When I read it I found the line:

"Forty-six percent of women who have abortions had not used a contraceptive method during the month they became pregnant. Of these women, 33% had perceived themselves to be at low risk for pregnancy, 32% had had concerns about contraceptive methods, 26% had had unexpected sex and 1% had been forced to have sex.[9]"

If this is where your numbers came from I find no evidence to claim they didn't know about contraceptive use, actually the opposite is reported. Was this other information reported elsewhere in the article that I missed?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 9:37 AM

ball_o_fire

I don't think there is really any debate that the people who usually get abortions are not among the most educated in society, but that wasn't the point I was arguing. However, the stats from the study reformedrightwinger used indicate that those people CHOSE not to have safe sex, not that they were unknowledgeable about how babies are made or not made. The information that more fully bolsters the claim that more sex education is needed to make sure contraceptives are used correctly is found in that 54% believed they were using contraceptives but still ended up pregnant. Still a valid argument but not as sensational as the claim that half essentially had no idea how to prevent conception. I don't argue that education is not the way to reduce unplanned pregnancies and abortion.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 11:22 AM

ball_o_fire

Furthermore, I would rather not step into your office, if it is the type of place where one mis-reads statistics to support a claim I am not arguing against, especially when a summary perusal of the source would have given you a much better basis for such a claim. Using the numbers I cited from reformedrightwinger's source against me, one could make the argument that roughly 15% of women who had abortions did so because they were unaware of contraceptive methods, far short of the nearly 50% originally argued. I contend that I am more than partially correct in this example.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 11:29 AM

Guillermo,

As I've said a couple of times here, I am NOT arguing against better sex education and contraceptive efforts, you are in essence preaching to the choir. I was objecting to what I would argue are sensationalist claims used for shock value.

I want to make clear I am not arguing for AOUM models, but where have you found the statistics on AOUM schools vs. comprehensive education schools?

Again, I would appreciate people not labeling me, but it seems too much to ask. Although I may be more conservative than you, that doesn't make me a Conservative. I don't appreciate being called a Conservative by you anymore that I appreciate being called a Liberal by Sam. I also would like to apologize to anyone I've unfairly labeled and if I do so again please let me know.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 11:38 AM

Guillermo,

Where in that source does it indicate that those 750,000 unintended pregnancies results from AOUM classes? Again I argue you are trying to find sensational numbers to scare people. From my reading:

"By 2002, one-third of teens had not received any formal instruction about contraception.[9]

* More than one in five adolescents (21% of females and 24% of males) received abstinence education without receiving instruction about birth control"

By my reading of your numbers with this in mind I would understand that of the 750,000 unintended pregnancies at most roughly 250,000 of the young women had never had any contraceptive education. Of the remaining 500,000 who have had education roughly 100,000 had recieved AOUM education. If 25% of them had abortions that would leave AOUM education responsible for 25,000 abortions far short of the 200,000 you claim.

Maybe I'm looking at the numbers incorrectly, I've never claimed to me a mathmagician but it seems you are exaggerating. I also didn't see where you found the 82% number of 750,000 but I assume I just missed it.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 11:55 AM

Guillermo,

A) True I should not have accused reformedrightwinger of sensationalism and didn't mean to do so directly, I just get annoyed when people on either side throw large and impressive numbers around without evidence. So if I've offended reformedrightwinger I apologize. That said, how do you defend your claim that AOUM is responsible for 200,000 abortions as anything other than shock numbers or an attempt to score (albeit meanlingless)points.?

As for mis-stating numbers, that is one reason I try to avoid it unless I have something directly to link it to, there have been several times I've thought of things to say but without the ability to back them up due to poor memory I choose not to post.

B)I didn't argue his/her reasoning wasn't valid merely his/her numbers which again seemed to me numbers meant to shock and grab attention. However when one uses faulty or sensational numbers, not saying that he/she did, it does cast other doubts on one's reasoning and claims.

C) Thank you, you are forgiven.

D)I was rather hoping for a quick summary or a particularly strong source, especially if this is something you've dedicated research hours to. I see no reason to re-invent the wheel nor to search through 5 million google hits. If you are going to make a claim I feel the onus is on you to support the claim not challenge another to refute an unsubstantiated claim. If I were to make an argument about something I have done research and have many sources concerning I would try to direct a layman to the most clear and accessible support. I have not spent hours researching this topic nor do I wish to.

That said, what in the sources you have cited so far indicate that AOUM is responsible for that shocking number of abortions which would surely give any anti-abortionist pause?

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 12:32 PM

Guillermo,

I apologize I mis-read and missed the "portion" you are indeed correct and my breakdown would indicate that AOUM has failed to prevent a number of abortions. I meant no straw man argument, nor trying to "get you" I merely made an error.

I wouldn't assume your knowledge ends at sources cited here but unfortunately without you providing more evidence that is the only source of your argument I have to go on. I don't know what you know unless you tell me first.

If AOUM has been the prevalent course of study and if the abortion rates are declining, is it not possible that it is also contibuting to the decrease in abortions? Or does it only lead to higher rates of abortion and the minority of programs that teach comprehensive sex education are the only ones that reduce the numbers of abortions. If that is true just think of how few abortions there will be next year when comprehensive courses are the most prevalent!

Indeed I am sensational in the non media sense of the word, just ask my dog, he thinks I'm fabulous.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 12:41 PM

Senior Loud,

Would you prefer that I only make sweeping vague comments and haphazard insults? You chastise me for not debating, and when I try to debate an issue I am mocked for exploring the tiniest detail. In my experience it is in the detail that people find commonalities and compromise rather than in the general statements. Perhaps you see it differently and you and your styled "con-bots" will add something of value with your pissing matches.

-- Posted by SWNebr Transplant on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 1:11 PM

Guilermo,

My apologies for being tardy, I have to work for a living, and pay taxes for your continuing education.

Your claim that Abstinence only sex education is the most prevalent form for sex education is, false. My wife and I contacted several neighbors, relatives, and old acquaintances who have children that have graduated, or in the upper classes of high school. All said abstinence was brought up, not as the primary focus, but as a supplement to a comprehensive sex ed program. Consumed about 10 to 15 percent of the time that contraception and STD's was discussed. The pill and rubbers took up the rest.

Again, what goes of in the real world versus what you read about in your text books.

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 7:03 PM

Public schools in Kansas City, MO & KS (4)

Public schools in Denver CO (2)

Public schools in Lincoln NE (2)

Public schools in Western NE (11)

Private school in South Bend IN (1)

Do you know how to properly use a condom, Iggy?

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 7:52 PM

Really, how is it possible, to not know how to use a condom? Is there any male of reproductive age who hasn't tried one on, for a practice run? Aren't they idiot proof, if not lawyer proof. But I suppose, if you fish hard enough, you'll find the data that fits your agenda.

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 9:04 PM

Apologies to all for veering away from everyone's favorite subject.

But, Sam and company, before all the NeoCons start screaming about those terrible Democrats using obscure parliamentary procedures to pass legislation:

Thought you might want to look at some numbers.

---------------------------------------------

When the Democrats controlled the House:

From the 95th to 98th Congresses (1977-84),

There were eight self-executing rules comprising exactly ONE percent of the 857 total rules granted.

During Speaker Tip O'Neill's (D-Mass.) final term in the 99th Congress, there were 20 self-executing rules (12 percent).(Most to secure passage of legislation sought by Pres. Reagan, with members of his own party opposing.)

During Rep. Jim Wright's (D-Texas) only full term as Speaker, in the 100th Congress, there were 18 self-executing rules (17 percent).

They reached a high point of 30 under Speaker Tom Foley (D-Wash.) during the final Democratic Congress, the 103rd, for 22 percent of all rules.

When Republicans took power in 1995:

Under Speaker Newt Gingrich (R-Ga.);

There were 38 and 52 self-executing rules in the 104th and 105th Congresses (1995-1998), making up 25 percent and 35 percent of all rules, respectively.

Under Speaker Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.) there were 40, 42 and 30 self-executing rules in the 106th, 107th and 108th Congresses (22 percent, 37 percent and 22 percent, respectively)- for a 30.3 per cent average.

Nancy Pelosi has been speaker for some time now, the possible use of the self executing rule getting the Health Care Reform bill past the conservative blockade, will be the first of her tenure. So far her average is ZERO.

But she is abusing the Constitution even considering a parliamentary manuever considered to be reserved for Republicans by some.

By the way folks, haven't quite got this figured out -- Idaho's Rep. Congressman Larry Craig got arrested in the Minneapolis Airport Men's Restroom for soliciting a stranger.With strong GOP leadership report, he almost stuck around for another election.

GOP Senator Ensign had one of his best friends as a chief aide, and the friends wife assisted with various election and Senate office items. Senator Ensign also had one specific activity for her as his mistr4ess. Harry Reid is considered so square, he is positively CUBIC -- Ensign committs adultery with a friend/employee's wife.

GOP version -- Harry Reid is evil.

N.Y. Dem Massa was exposed and sent packing by that "Nutcase Liberal Pelosi," the day she learned of Massa's ongoing pattern of misconduct.

The problem here is spelled H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y-!!

Gearjammer -- still looking for a rig for this friend. We caught his old company [After the labor court judge caught six company officials in bald-faced lies, offering "cooked" books and clearly forged documents] attempting to Black Ball him in the industry.

Seems some dirty ol' boy went to a state where recording incoming telephone calls is legal, as long as the receiving party is recording and advises the caller, he "..needs information for the record."

The Company HR Director gave a great five-minute impersonation of a corporate lunatic, endlessly attacking this driver.

It may take five or six years, but a driver may end up owning that trucking company, if there is anything left.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 10:57 PM

I don't really care how they fall on the sword, come November it won't matter. What concerns me is that we are a broke nation living on generations worth of credit and this just adds another soon to be broke liberal ponzi scheme to the mix. When it all goes south, and it will all go south, only the liberals will be to blame and history will have proven once again that socialism is too expensive.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Wed, Mar 17, 2010, at 11:06 PM

Backassward Henri,

Somehow, being impressed by some financial illiterate bleating about the richest nation in the world being "broke." is not on any serious economic authorities' radar.

You want to know how "broke" the U.S. is -- Look at how many individuals, companies, holding companies and even shadowy "conglomerates" want to move huge amounts of capital into THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

This nation is suffering from TWENTY (Two decades combined)years of the Bush family in or one heart beat away from the White House [too many BUSH years by 20].

Those two presidents are responsible for the entire national debt -- All $12-TRILLION and counting.

Do the math, $12,000,000,000,000, at an average of FIVE PERCENT simple interest only -- That's some serious annual debt service, plus paying down the total by $500,000,000 annually.

Dadburn close to $26-TRILLION just to get our fannies out of the Bush mess.

Bill Clinton took a half billion off Poppa Bush's debt, which exceeded all national debt from 1782 until G.H.W. Bush took office.

Our national debt was down under $4-Trillion in January 2000, and the program was in place within the executive and legislative branches to continue the payoff, leaving the nation debt free in 2010.

WHAT DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT THAT SIMPLE FACT?

If we can hold the national debt to $12-TRILLION; which considering the mess DDD left enroute to Crawford, TX, Wyoming and places unknown; is clearly unlikely; and begin the pay off, the U.S. may be out of debt in my youngest offspring's lifetime.

Probably not, but maybe.

THAT'S THE BUSH/CHENEY LEGACY.

Not the Clinton/Gore legacy.

Not Lincoln's legacy.

Not Andrew Jackson's legacy.

Not Teddy Roosevelt's legacy.

Not Woodrow Wilson's legacy.

Not even Warren "Tea Pot Dome" Harding's legacy.

Not Hoobert Heever's legacy.

Not the FDR Legacy.

Not Harry Truman's legacy.

Not Jimmy Carter's legacy.

Not Richard Nixon's legacy.

Not JFK's and LBJ's Legacy.

It is --

GEORGE HERBERT WALKER/GEORGE W. BUSH'S LEGACY.

Probably two generation of national debt.

As incredibly stupid, self-serving, idiotic or however you want to describe that BUSH FAMILY legacy, the United States will survive.

The start is to get our total national health care overhead reduced to less than 10% within five years. Instead of being 25% before 2020.

If Health Care Costs soar to 25%, WE ARE BROKE.

Get it down to 15% in 2011.

Reduce it to 12% in 2012.

Then to 11% by 2014.

Below 10% by 2016.

The math is simple.

The process is brutal.

Churchill described it accurately -- "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all others."

Well established axiom -- "Democracy is messy."

Attempting to answer through "Fox Anus" Brett Bare's non-stop interruptions and talking over his answers to the media mouth's many questions yesterday --

The President said clearly that he has no control and no president should ever have control over any portion of the House and Senate.

Be it rules and procedures, voting process, required majority percentage for various votes, reconciling legislative differences between the two houses, or any other factor.

This nation has SEPARATION OF POWERS under the Constitution.

The President occupies Teddy Roosevelt's "BLOODY PULPIT."

The president can negotiate, debate, consult, cajole, argue, preach, pontificate, smooth talk or indicate delaying or stopping federal projects in a particular state, or offer to support a particular project in particular one city, county or state.

Every president since George Washington has used the fiscal "Carrot and Stick" tactic to get legislation.

Lyndon Johnson's great power came because he KNEW where everyone's skeletons were buried, who put them there and how much they would damage anyone directly involved if dug up.

When the battle for votes for the Civil Rights Bill was down to the wire, LBJ personally telephoned the Black "Real Wife" of the Senate's Number One "White Supremacy" advocate and asked her help getting the Senator to vote for the Civil Rights Bill.

She did -- and her live-in racist white senator did vote for the bill.

The Kennedys were often ineffective, because too many people knew of their ongoing misconduct.

Ike almost stayed in Europe after WWII, planning to divorce an alcoholic wife and marrying his mistress/driver Kay Summersby.

The sons and grandsons of Lawrence of Arabia could have been Arab Sheiks, Sultans, Princes or Kings, except he wanted to ride his motorcycle through the English countryside after WWI. [Of course, the girls would have been considered livestock, good for menial household and livestock care tasks, teenage pleasure toys for selected elderly husbands and child bearing.]

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Thu, Mar 18, 2010, at 5:57 AM

Backassward Henri,

Somehow, being impressed by some financial illiterate bleating about the richest nation in the world being "broke." is not on any serious economic authorities' radar.

You want to know how "broke" the U.S. is -- Look at how many individuals, companies, holding companies and even shadowy "conglomerates" want to move huge amounts of capital into THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

This nation is suffering from TWENTY (Two decades combined)years of the Bush family in or one heart beat away from the White House [too many BUSH years by 20].

Those two presidents are responsible for the entire national debt -- All $12-TRILLION and counting.

Do the math, $12,000,000,000,000, at an average of FIVE PERCENT simple interest only -- That's some serious annual debt service, plus paying down the total by $500,000,000 annually.

Dadburn close to $26-TRILLION just to get our fannies out of the Bush mess.

Bill Clinton took a half billion off Poppa Bush's debt, which exceeded all national debt from 1782 until G.H.W. Bush took office.

Our national debt was down under $4-Trillion in January 2000, and the program was in place within the executive and legislative branches to continue the payoff, leaving the nation debt free in 2010.

WHAT DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT THAT SIMPLE FACT?

If we can hold the national debt to $12-TRILLION; which considering the mess DDD left enroute to Crawford, TX, Wyoming and places unknown; is clearly unlikely; and begin the pay off, the U.S. may be out of debt in my youngest offspring's lifetime.

Probably not, but maybe.

THAT'S THE BUSH/CHENEY LEGACY.

Not the Clinton/Gore legacy.

Not Lincoln's legacy.

Not Andrew Jackson's legacy.

Not Teddy Roosevelt's legacy.

Not Woodrow Wilson's legacy.

Not even Warren "Tea Pot Dome" Harding's legacy.

Not Hoobert Heever's legacy.

Not the FDR Legacy.

Not Harry Truman's legacy.

Not Jimmy Carter's legacy.

Not Richard Nixon's legacy.

Not JFK's and LBJ's Legacy.

It is --

GEORGE HERBERT WALKER/GEORGE W. BUSH'S LEGACY.

Probably two generation of national debt.

As incredibly stupid, self-serving, idiotic or however you want to describe that BUSH FAMILY legacy, the United States will survive.

The start is to get our total national health care overhead reduced to less than 10% within five years. Instead of being 25% before 2020.

If Health Care Costs soar to 25%, WE ARE BROKE.

Get it down to 15% in 2011.

Reduce it to 12% in 2012.

Then to 11% by 2014.

Below 10% by 2016.

The math is simple.

The process is brutal.

Churchill described it accurately -- "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all others."

Well established axiom -- "Democracy is messy."

Attempting to answer through "Fox Anus" Brett Bare's non-stop interruptions and talking over his answers to the media mouth's many questions yesterday --

The President said clearly that he has no control and no president should ever have control over any portion of the House and Senate.

Be it rules and procedures, voting process, required majority percentage for various votes, reconciling legislative differences between the two houses, or any other factor.

This nation has SEPARATION OF POWERS under the Constitution.

The President occupies Teddy Roosevelt's "BLOODY PULPIT."

The president can negotiate, debate, consult, cajole, argue, preach, pontificate, smooth talk or indicate delaying or stopping federal projects in a particular state, or offer to support a particular project in particular one city, county or state.

Every president since George Washington has used the fiscal "Carrot and Stick" tactic to get legislation.

Lyndon Johnson's great power came because he KNEW where everyone's skeletons were buried, who put them there and how much they would damage anyone directly involved if dug up.

When the battle for votes for the Civil Rights Bill was down to the wire, LBJ personally telephoned the Black "Real Wife" of the Senate's Number One "White Supremacy" advocate and asked her help getting the Senator to vote for the Civil Rights Bill.

She did -- and her live-in racist white senator did vote for the bill.

The Kennedys were often ineffective, because too many people knew of their ongoing misconduct.

Ike almost stayed in Europe after WWII, planning to divorce an alcoholic wife and marrying his mistress/driver Kay Summersby.

The sons and grandsons of Lawrence of Arabia could have been Arab Sheiks, Sultans, Princes or Kings, except he wanted to ride his motorcycle through the English countryside after WWI. [Of course, the girls would have been considered livestock, good for menial household and livestock care tasks, teenage pleasure toys for selected elderly husbands and child bearing.]

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Thu, Mar 18, 2010, at 6:12 AM

GI -- You think you are actually going to be able to teach Chunky and his brethren the proper technique for using the simplest birth control device?

They cannot learn to calculate GHW Bush and $4-Trillion PLUS DubYah Bush and $8-Trillion == a whole bunch of waste.

Teaching such advanced Birth Control technology is a lost cause from Day One.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Thu, Mar 18, 2010, at 3:26 PM

OH yest the literary quality of Herndon Hanks writing, as Bill would have us belive.

Good thing Hank lives in the past because the future is getting bad.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 12:45 PM

Yes, who needs to think. You will like whats in the bill just as soon as we get it passed. Just wait and see. Obama couldn't even say what will be voted on.

What a line. Enjoy your future Bill, your taxes will be going up.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 1:37 PM

Guillermo,

Do you think that perhaps one leg of the solution in slowing down the rate of teen pregnancy and abortion is to educate the parents of how to discuss human sexuality? Our church has a class for parents of children entering junior high, we took it, and it has made a world of difference in our family. All the other parents who have taken this class say the same. As do their children, some of whom are about to become parents themselves.

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 1:41 PM

Yes Senior you are correct. The kids mirror the parents. As my son grew up and my wife and I participated in parent teacher conferences, plays, music and other events, we noticed a large number of kids whose parents never showed up.

I firmly believe that if a parent wants their kids to excel the parent needs to respect the effort the kids put out and show up in support.

The parents need to set up a household that encourages study time and play time, and insist that both get done.

The kids appreciate involved parents and adults.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 2:42 PM

Guillermo,

I don't believe any moral constraints were imposed on any of us, if anything we were released of them. In a group setting of 10 couples, we first discussed the importance of being non-judgemental towards each other. Gossiping was also forbidden. This is a class of total openness, or transparency. We each had workbooks that asked our most inner secrets of our personal sexual history. Revealing our answers was totally optional. It is amazing that once trust has been established, people do open up.

The purpose of this course is to reveal your personal testimony of your sexuality. Parents tell each other of theirs, and it is difficult. Mothers, then tell their sons, and father talk to their daughters. This is extremely difficult and painful. We not only discuss the how's and why's of human reproduction, but also the emotional component. This part explains the Bible's standpoint on sex. Each failed sexual relation a person has and it's effect on future relationships. It's effect on trust, and honesty.

It's weird, but it certainly opened a line of communication with our child. And you'll see the difference in others children. Boys noticeably became young men, they treated women with much more respect and with honor. The girls, mine included, became young women, walking with confidence, not with fear.

Side note, 4 of the 10 women in this course revealed that they had been molested or raped as teenagers, imagine what their testimonies were like.

-- Posted by Chunky Peanut Butter on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 5:18 PM

"Good thing Hank lives in the past because the future is getting bad.-- Posted by boojum666 on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 12:45 PM"

BooHoo --

You have such awesome insight. Something like a Third Eye.

Just too bad you have to drop your pants for it to have any view back there.

----------------------------------------------

I will promise to give that living in the past some consideration, except right now time is sort of occupied trying to get 50,000 solid homes built in Haiti and eventually 500,000 superior homes built in the U.S. and Canada -- but it might be fun to spend some time living in the past.

Might let a person get away from this mindless, modern neo-con you represent.

Check the numbers for that evil House Procedure:

-----------------------------------

When the Democrats controlled the House:

From the 95th to 98th Congresses (1977-84),

There were eight self-executing rules comprising exactly ONE percent of the 857 total rules granted.

During Speaker Tip O'Neill's (D-Mass.) final term in the 99th Congress, there were 20 self-executing rules (12 percent).(Most to secure passage of legislation sought by Pres. Reagan, with members of his own party opposing.)

During Rep. Jim Wright's (D-Texas) only full term as Speaker, in the 100th Congress, there were 18 self-executing rules (17 percent).

They reached a high point of 30 under Speaker Tom Foley (D-Wash.) during the final Democratic Congress, the 103rd, for 22 percent of all rules.

When Republicans took power in 1995:

Under Speaker Newt Gingrich (R-Ga.);

There were 38 and 52 self-executing rules in the 104th and 105th Congresses (1995-1998), making up 25 percent and 35 percent of all rules, respectively.

Under Speaker Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.) there were 40, 42 and 30 self-executing rules in the 106th, 107th and 108th Congresses (22 percent, 37 percent and 22 percent, respectively)- for a 30.3 per cent average.

Nancy Pelosi has been speaker for some time now, the possible use of the self executing rule getting the Health Care Reform bill past the conservative blockade, will be the first of her tenure. So far her average is ZERO.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 5:45 PM

Hank! 50,000 homes,then 500,000 homes what a line of bull. No one needs a third eye to know you are just a coffee shop expert

the only one dropping pants to blow a line of bull is you.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 6:41 PM

Boo,

Place a foot upon each shoulder and shove!!!

There is no way to build affordable, ecologically and natural disaster safe, durable homes with conventional means.

I saw the first of the best intelligent technology I've seen in my "Old Fart's" lifetime on the west side of Frenchman's Creek valley out near Wauneta in 1958.

I've studied the technology for 50 years.

Irony of ironies, the original promoter who adapted the key equipment for the most common construction method is hiding out in South America to escape assorted misconduct charges.

But the key equipment he promoted so heavily and his hugely flawed business plan promoted with the equipment has resulted in stagnation.

It's the only technology where relatively unskilled labor can produce superior structures with virtually 100% "GREEN" materials.

The buildings are stronger after 200 years than the day they are completed, they reduce energy consumption 75%-80%, eliminate hazard from Tornadoes, Hurricanes, lightning, wildfires, earthquakes and other natural hazards except, of course, flooding if anyone is dumb enough to build in a flood zone.

This has been proven by responsible mid-west Ag Engineering school research.

There is one glaring FACT about you BOO.

There is no way to underestimate your ignorance.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Sat, Mar 20, 2010, at 8:38 AM

My god hank you have discovered the holy grail of cheap renewable housing!

"The buildings are stronger after 200 years than the day they are completed, they reduce energy consumption 75%-80%, eliminate hazard from Tornadoes, Hurricanes, lightning, wildfires, earthquakes and other natural hazards except, of course, flooding if anyone is dumb enough to build in a flood zone.

This has been proven by responsible mid-west Ag Engineering school research"

Where are all these wonder houses being built?

The time frame you describe and the location leads me to think you are talking about a Soddy.

Of course the modern equivalent would be a rammed earth house, a hay bale house or even a old tire house with the voids packed with soil. Unfortunaly none of these are economicaly viabel or we would see entire subdivisions built of these materials.

No I think you are blowing smoke again. I am glad you have shoulders otherwise you would disappear completley.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Sat, Mar 20, 2010, at 11:19 AM

Boo,

With your profound ignorance actively engaged.

Enter Earth Sheltered Technology into the GOOGLE search and follow your nose.

U. of Minn and Texas A&M did the research years ago. Have one of the books on my bedside table.

An effective business model requires $14-Million up to $18-Million investment for U.S./Canadian startup.

Tenth year operating net $1.5-Billion-- Return on Investment = 1,000%.

At that point, 50,000 homes annually.

Reinvesting 100% for twenty years, the earth's housing needs are being fulfilled.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Sun, Mar 21, 2010, at 12:31 AM

Hank, I know about earth sheltered technology.

As they cost more, need specific location and orientation, this will always limit this type of construction, as evidenced by the lack of popularity and use.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Sun, Mar 21, 2010, at 8:32 AM

Boo,

Simple fact -- With the standard 'Mom and Pop" EST contractor business model -- building one house in Iowa, contracting another by word of mouth in Idaho, another in Oklahoma, the next in California, ad infinitum.

MOST CONTRACTORS WHO BOUGHT IN FOR $250,000 thirty to 45 years ago went belly up within two years, following that word-of-mouth approach.

The bulk of their equipment was idle 70-80% of the time.

With an efficient business plan and state-of-the art equipment, each project could turn out 1200-1800 sq. ft. homes at the rate of eight to ten weekly, 48 weeks annually.

Put two project crews and equipment in each major market, exceed 1,000 homes annually.

Some pretty well experienced pros have developed and contributed to both cost numbers and the business plan.

Yeah, the expense of scattered, custom EST mansions can be incredible.

Saw one 6800 sq. ft. place which took almost 800 cubic yards of truck delivered concrete mix last year from a mix plant 150 miles distant.

The shaped rebar produced in a shop 200 miles distant cost more than the completed house should have cost.

The equipment was on site 9 weeks -- instead of the five days in a well-managed operation.

That meant the crew was there in expensive motels, eating restaurant meals for ten weeks.

Their expenses also exceeded the legitimate cost for construction. Add in moving costs across half the United States, road time and equipment down time.

The holdup of EST has not been the technology, but the promoter's scam business plan.

He also included a First Right of Refusal to buy back the key equipment if the original buyer gave up.

The only units he failed to get came about because that contractor borrowed against the equipment and got foreclosed.

Boo, KNOWING ALL ABOUT SOMETHING, ain't the same as knowing how to look at it and decipher how to do it better.

Doing it better than the guy who has done it poorly is where the profit is made.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Sun, Mar 21, 2010, at 2:22 PM

"The holdup of EST has not been the technology, but the promoter's scam business plan."

Well hank there are no proprietary technologies in any Earth sheltered homes, no copyrighted construction plans, no registered trademarks.

Any contractor with a set of concrete forms can build an EST home. Reinforced concrete block can be used or perhaps the best would be ICF systems.

No Hank, it is simply the expense and orientation limitation of the EST homes that keep them on the fringe.

-- Posted by boojum666 on Sun, Mar 21, 2010, at 5:02 PM

I can't wait to see his legacy when the financial pain this health mess will cause sinks in. Add that to our broke social security and broke medicare and medicaid and the legacy of liberalism will once again be proven to be unsustainable. Why libs can't read the history books is beyond me.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 9:30 AM

Government mandating behavior and government creating another ponzi scheme that's unsustainable without bankrupting the nation or raising taxes on the middle class to extreme levels. Look up the debt and interest this nation faces in light of all of our entitlement programs and it's not real hard to understand my objections.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 10:24 AM

I need look no further or get more specific than the history of social security from the inception to the current state it is in now and compare it to what just happened. When you incent your citizens not to contribute to society but take from it THEY WILL. And they will continue until the system is upside down, which ours already is. This nation has just opened up another line of credit when we can't pay the cards we have now. UTTER LUNACY!!

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 10:59 AM

Dwell in the minutia if you want reformed. It is the big picture that will bring down social security and health care.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 11:13 AM

For those who actually believe this site can predict the impact on taxes and ind insurance premiums, see the link below.

www.youareanidiot.gov

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 1:36 PM

Not religious at all, I just happen to agree with a lot of what conservatives believe. So wrong again senior. What are you doing here given your inability to understand history or finances?

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 1:49 PM

reformed, I made the link up and you are the namesake of my link.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 1:50 PM

conbot zing werr wiz is a counterpoint?? We are broke and we just opened another line of credit we can't pay back. Pull your head out and watch what happens.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 2:12 PM

Conservatives will rule the day when the money runs out and that day of reckoning is rapidly approaching. The movement is just beginning.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 2:24 PM

Watch and learn young sucklings, watch and learn.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM

Not mad at all. My sardonic grin is wide and the fun will be had in the next few years watching the realization of liberal overspending take it's toll.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Mon, Mar 22, 2010, at 8:26 PM

I have read Frum, I would refer you to Gingrich's column on the matter. Besides's, he's a flippin Canadian.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 8:22 AM

SOME RICE BOWLS ARE BEING BROKEN.

The overly-large and constantly over filled "Rice Bowls" of the Health Insurance Industry will be smashed during he next few years.

They are screaming.

What a Surprise!!!

The U.S. has a history of Special Privilege industries and corporations growing accustomed to unearned income protected by law.

The old "Ma Bell" and the entire major telephone company industry for nearly a century.

Much of the Insurance Industry.

Standard practice -- Show the "regulators" the expenditures and be granted a profit margin above each dollar spent.

Easy -- Pay higher wages at all levels, with stupendous executive salaries, bonuses and benefits.

Build excess capacity.

Dedicate massive funds to the "expense" of research.

Then assign rights to those research results to other corporations controlled by members of your executive committee, board of directors and top management -- with Sweetheart agreements.

Those on the inside profit by the Billions, average stockholders get the shaft, Uncle Sam gets shorted -- and the new corporation financed with unpaid taxes is established in Ireland or Mexico, Brazil or Asia.

The Health Insurance Industry's ten years of excess is coming to an end. Net Profits which increased from $2.5-Billion collectively for the industry to $12.5 Billion under DubYah and the Draft Dodgers will trim back to a reasonable level and average people will be able to afford insurance again.

Overpaid insurance industry people will be forced to accept earnings on par with the people they have been skinning alive -- and dead.

Nothing can be done for those who died because their insurance was cancelled after 30 years of paying premiums.

After all they were criminal enough to contract a fatal condition.

How careless!!

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 9:47 AM

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?i...

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 9:48 AM

He is waiting on the CNA to clean him up after his trip to the latrine. Then it's nappy time.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 12:01 PM

Liberal spending is the only thing about to go extinct. Watch and learn young suckling as the events in California unfold.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 1:36 PM

Spending is killing CA. Liberalism is killing CA. As CA goes so does the rest of the country.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 3:03 PM

I am not sure if I was more appalled by the vitriol in this post and subsequent follow-ups or the fact that the McCook Gazette by allowing it, thought it was good public discourse. Yes, while I view myself as a "moderate", I do unabashedly fall to the left side of the line in political discourse and as such would call myself a "liberal" any day of the week without shame. In that vein I would of course disagree with the conservative view on many issues, but as a human being it doesn't prevent me from being able to have civil discourse without having to resort to emotional baiting to try to prove my point. That sort of rhetoric achieves nothing but to divert from the issue at hand, making it easy to depart from cognitive reasoning and an examination of the facts. Unfortunately that makes me some sort of "intellectual elitist" I guess instead of intellectually curious which as good citizens we have a "moral" obligation to exercise.

But the point of this post is morality, which actually might have been a good source of intelligent discussion had it not been a rhetorical question couched to serve up the stinking mess that followed. The question of liberal morality is not one that I can speak to for the "evil liberal masses", i.e. I have brain cells that work without talking points. I am a Christian < gasp> and that certainly informs my sense of right and wrong. However, it's certainly not a requirement to be a Christian to be moral. But within the Christian perspective how we grapple with societal questions, the moral objective (in my mind) is how to protect and preserve human life and dignity. Do those views often clash with what I believe the U.S. Constitution lays out in a broad manner....certainly. And to deny that they don't as a conservative is just a flat out lie (Think capital punishment vs. abortion). There is a serious danger to think that the Constitution must be interpreted as a Christian document. Do some research...the framers were deists who believed in freedom FROM religion, not the majority takeover OF religion. Am I pro-choice...certainly. A woman has a right to control her own body that supersedes that of the right of a being that is questionably called a life before a certain point (88% of abortion occurs before 8 weeks. See gov't statistics). To cite a 13 year old rape victim story only proves my point. My personal moral choice is different, but I believe in individual freedom (within limits)and the right to privacy. Speaking of conflict, I just cannot fathom the rational thrown around that good Christians can't support universal healthcare. I mean, really??? In the same vein as abortion then, why in the world would one who is pro-life ignore the stunning infant mortality rate in this country and ignore the connection between that and health care? Other civilized, developed nations have. When universal healthcare is signed, no kid can be denied healthcare coverage. Wouldn't your rational on abortion extend to the living? Help the poor and needy?(gosh where is that written?), protect our citizens from bankruptcy stemming from emergency medical care? How in the world would this be construed as an immoral stance?

No, I personally don't support the NRA agenda but I recognize the importance of the 2nd amendment. That does not mean that there aren't limits. Like I personally agree with strict limits on abortion, the same should hold true for gun ownership. There is absolutely no rational for an AK-47 to be in a private citizen's hands. We endanger the public and those public servants that give their life to protect us and the apparent rights of criminals to "defend" themselves. You bet it this is a moral issue as well.

Economics? That is an entire post unto itself. Supply-side economics have proven a failure and a disaster for the middle and lower classes. The "invisible hand" of the free market has proven untrue and the events of the last 2 years are irrefutable proof. There IS such a thing as a "moral economy" that does not sacrifice half or more of the population nor destroy the capitalist ideal. Neither is it socialist, communist or the like. It's proven economic Keynesian theory born and bred here in the ole' US of A. The local library, I am sure, could be helpful to those honestly interested in solutions.

Labeling liberals as "Communists, Socialists, Marxists, Statists and Liberal thugs" would be laughable if not so sad, petty and ignorant. I am pretty sure a 5th grader (obviously intellectual elitist) is able to explain why they are incompatible ideologies. Of course the same epitaphs were thrown around when Social Security and Medicare legislation was introduced. I would have to assume that your "morality" would necessitate your refusal of social security payments at retirement along with "government-run medical care" as a senior. At any rate, the mentality and "morality" of those conservative fringe groupies was on display this week as the mob (true thugs)spit on members of congress, threw out the epitaph of "fa**ot" to Barney Frank the hated gay liberal and yelled the N-word at the respected civil rights leaders Rep. John Lewis. That's classy and moral behavior there for you. No one gets their way without compromise in this country...that is why it is called a democracy(!). With that in mind, there is a moral obligation to try and find a common ground that provides for the "general welfare and defense" of this country. It may not be totally to your liking, but it is better than the unproductive name calling and fear mongering that has unfortunately consumed the conservative movement right now. Good morale conservatives are needed in this country for balance. I hope they decide to come to the table soon.

-- Posted by Rygel on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 3:06 PM

Backassward Enrique:

California has had a conservative governor for eight years.

California was destroyed starting with the first drive for the first version of Prop. 13 nearly 50 years ago.

If you had the slightest hint of a clue about what California's problems are -- it would be the miracle of the decade.

Your lack of knowledge and/or understanding of California's decline is exceeded only by your unmitigated arrogance.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 3:31 PM

Two of the dumbest back to back posts of all time here. CA is not operated in a fiscally or socially conservative manner and Ray Charles could see that. Who cares what the political affiliation of the governor is. Spending liberally has nothing to do with political affiliation. Have you heard of George Bush?

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 4:34 PM

I stand corrected Joe.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 4:56 PM

The problem is complex alright. Liberals have amassed massive debt by spending too much money for all sorts of liberal social agendas and now they find the cupboard bare. What makes it complex is liberals don't have the brains to spend less (which afflicts many a liberal) so they will drive the state into ruin. The US is not far behind and when China cancels the credit cards the real fun begins. Watch and learn young sucklings.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Tue, Mar 23, 2010, at 6:52 PM

Your opponent Gilly is liberal spending perpetrated by liberals. In the coming years it is going to make you and your ilk look like the fools Joe and I already know you are.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Wed, Mar 24, 2010, at 8:42 AM

Watch and learn young suckling.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Wed, Mar 24, 2010, at 11:09 AM

The demise of the democrat party and how governments go broke with liberals in charge of the taxing and spending.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Wed, Mar 24, 2010, at 12:01 PM

Watch and learn young suckling.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Wed, Mar 24, 2010, at 1:45 PM

bot der whiz conbot dufus bot

-- Posted by hankherndon on Wed, Mar 24, 2010, at 3:56 PM

Rygel - "freedom FROM religion"??? Hardly. You really should read the document. It talks about freedom OF religion. And please, folks, spare me the diatribe of "separation". The Federalist Papers are rife with the logic and intent behind the founding documents. To say that the founders were 'deists' is misleading. Some certainly were, others took pains to separate their faith from their political ideology, some interwove the two, while others wore their faith on their sleeves. The deists, by the way, were drastically outnumbered by the Quakers alone.

I can appreciate your view of the second amendment, but I must disagree...as of this moment it becomes ENTIRELY appropriate for an American citizen to find in his arsenal, said AK-47. A dependable weapon with inexpensive ammo. Be sure to get your kids into those gun safety courses folks. We certainly don't want innocent folk getting killed. Where have I heard that before?

I also appreciate your view on women exercising rights over their own bodies. However, I'm wondering...in the case of pregnancy...didn't the woman, and the man for that matter, already exercise their reproductive rights? You must admit the government had no role in their getting into the sack...should now the government play a role in the couples personal accountability? (lets just leave the 1% of hard case abortions, ie rape and incest out of the equation...as it is akin to killing all the chickens to nip the fox)

And finally, your lament about name-calling and exibiting reprehesible behavior on the part of "conservatives" toward Americas finest representatives...makes good hay for the newsday. However...Can you point me to an audio or video source that A) actually has the 'slurs' present; and B) identifies the perpetrators as conservative?

If not, I guess we'll just have to dismiss entirely these unsubstantiated reports.

-- Posted by Mickel on Thu, Mar 25, 2010, at 12:21 AM

Portugal downgraded. The US under B Hussein Obama's fiscal prowess in next. Watch and learn young sucklings.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Thu, Mar 25, 2010, at 8:51 AM

Liked Barney dressed as a pimp too. I guess the censors are gay too. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Fri, Mar 26, 2010, at 10:43 AM

Nothing like Good Ol' Christian Militia Morality,

"Gonna kill us a cop!"

"Gonna ambush the funeral possession with lots of other cops and detonate Al Qaeda style roadside bombs to kill as many other cops as possible."

"Gonna start a national bloodbath!"

"All glory to the Prince of Peace!!!"

Hey Sam, wouldn't you just like to be driving through Michigan when that bloodbath starts?

Those big rigs do make real nice targets.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Wed, Mar 31, 2010, at 12:21 AM

The liberals are desperate. They are still trying to sell health care and are attaching some delusional nut jobs to the conservative movement. Meanwhile CA and NY are about to be bankrupt due to liberal spending and liberal social agendas. Do the fiscal math people and vote in November.

-- Posted by hankherndon on Thu, Apr 1, 2010, at 9:24 AM

Let us see if we can describe a counter-conservative Nihilist militia approach.

Suppose there is an armed militia composed of those who object to conservative writers and bloggers.

This militia's theory is that armed bands must crawl from under rocks to shoot conservative preachers, their families, supporters and any preacher supported by conservatives.

The idea to generate a violent conflict reducing all Christian regions and enclaves to ashes.

How many targeted conservatives would be slightly inclined to go after all public Nihilists and closet Nihilists until the threat to themselves could be guaranteed eliminated?

Remember the Crusaders justified their atrocities with Christian faith. The latest theory is that Prince William of Scotland was the last of the Knights Templar and lead numerous extensive expeditions and explorations of what are now Canada's Maritime Provinces, New England and the upper Mississippi Valley (Illinois, Indiana, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Missouri and Kentucky) for a safe place to hide the the Holy Grail.

Myth, slightly fact-based legend or historically accurate -- ignored is the unrestrained violence against the Holy Land in the name of religion.

Did religious fervor excuse the atrocities?

Did religious zealotry justify massive public, organized religious and Monarch's support?

The stimulation for these extremist militia movements comes from "talkers" who justify any means in the support of their beliefs and ideas.

When that disembodied voice coming from the pickup radio at 1 a.m. entones, "These people are destroying our nation, they MUST BE STOPPED and only brave, dedicated patriots can stop them!!!"

Eventually some will decide to act upon his words, only with a mind which can be so easily twisted and stirred, there is no way to determine what direction the action will take.

With the latest extremist crowd, that direction was apparently kill one cop at random, wait for hundreds of cops to attend his funeral and kill as many as possible of those cops.

This was to have launched an all-out war between the "good guys" and the "Bad guy cops."

What was scary, those extremist, self-styled good guys were heavily armed with automatic weapons.

Now that is a comforting thought.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Fri, Apr 2, 2010, at 5:01 PM

Boo,

It there was any indication you have a clue about anything, I could present you the numbers for down the street EST development building.

Concrete block will not create a economical EST structure.

Speed, economy and maximum quality REQUIRES:

Rapid, hydraulic or worm-geared erection of trailer mounted dome mold-forms.

Simultaneous construction of two or three complete domes, with half-domes resting atop the ledges of vertical walls on the full dome sections.

Three 30X55 ft. domes = 4500 sq. ft structures, complete and ready for interior finish for less than $25 per sq. ft.

It means production -- earthwork competed, ballast in place at each site, dome mold-form trailers backed in, erected, steel shaped on site in advance, eight man crews tying steel on each dome and the first concrete pumped within 12 hours from start. [Electrical and plumbing are stubbed in from inside the dome mold while steel is being tied.]

Forty hours from start, mold-forms are collapsed and moved to the next site.

Additional mold forms are erected in Site Two as the steel work is complete on Site One. Second shift of steel workers begin tying. Dawn the second day, Site two is poured.

Site Three mold trailers are backed into place, forms erected and steel work begins about dusk the second day. Pours start about dawn.

Mold forms are relocated to Site Four from Site One, erected by dawn, and steel work starts.

By the end of the first week, one complete dome structure of 4500 sq. ft. can be completed daily -- or two 2,000 sq. ft. structures -- or four or five 1,500 sq. ft. structures.

By developing sand and gravel quarries, bring in railroad bulk carrier carloads of cement -- cubic yard concrete costs can be reduced to $5-$10 per yard. A 4500 sq. ft. structure will require less than 500 cubic yards in the domes.

The exposed domes cure for 30 days.

At Day 16, floors are prepared and concrete poured for slabs, or for steel joists.

[Simple reality, steel joist supported floors will last the structure's 400-600 year live expectancy. The domes will be stronger after 200 years than the day constructed.]

At day 29, water proofing is applied to dome exterior surface, three-inch drain lines set along the backs of the domes, down the sides and within the "VEES", earth is backfilled to 24 inches above the dome tops -- and smoothed.

A rubber blanket is spread and SEALED atop that fill.

Final fill to a depth of five to ten feet above the dome tops is completed and prepared for seeding and planting.

While the final earthwork is being finished, the interior is being prepared. Some structures may receive custom on-site interiors. Others will have "modular interiors" delivered via trailers, and rolled into the domes. With predesigned water, elecrical, cable and sewer connections -- these modular units can be installed and finished within 12-48 hours.

Pre-fabbed metal and glass fronts are lifted into place by crane, bolted into place, sealed -- and the structure is ready for occupancy with the front development finished.

Start to finish -- less than 40 days, except for high-end custom interiors and elaborate fronts and landscaping.

The technology is capital intensive and requires incentive-motivated workers.

No union, no Monday morning hangovers.

Annual incomes 25-50% above standard for production concrete workers.

Molds can be designed for 20X50 feet, 26X50, 28X55, 30X55 on in any other size desired.

A "one story condo" structure with 1,000 to 1600 sq. ft. starter homes could be constructed in groups of 10, 20, 50 or 200 along a ridgeline.

Boo, those of us who have been evaluating EST and considering the technology know the finished homes can be ready for occupancy for as little as $50 per sq. ft.

Negative thinking will never do it.

The key is determining the goal and determining what will work.

Just say NO does not work for sex, drugs or business.

If General Leslie R. Groves and Robert Oppenheimer had said "We can't do it" or "It will be difficult and we don't want to try." -- The atomic bomb would not have ended WWII in the Pacific.

If Ike had said, "We can land in France," the European War might still not be won.

George Patton said, "My men of the Third Army will do what has never been done by any combat army in history" and Bastogne was relieved.

Critical thinking and planning get the job done.

Negative thinking never accomplished "diddly."

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Sun, Apr 18, 2010, at 10:14 PM

"OH yest the literary quality of Herndon Hanks writing, as Bill would have us belive. Good thing Hank lives in the past because the future is getting bad.-- Posted by boojum666 on Fri, Mar 19, 2010, at 12:45 PM

Boo,

You are supremely unintelligent. On the one hand Boo declares I live in the past.

On the other hand, declares there is no future in EST construction, because you have only seen the past and never considered the future.

On the other hand, believes in the Tea Party.

On the other hand, ---

Whoops -- about to credit you with being the human octupussy -- because you do seem to have countless other hands.

-----------------------------------

"You dined with Patton didn't you hunk. Admit it.

-- Posted by edmundburke on Mon, Apr 19, 2010, at 9:19 AM"

Eduardo --

Some of my heroes were with Patton across Europe.

One public works director for a small town was Patton's Re-Con sergeant in Sicily. At 41 years of age, volunteered at 8 a.m. Dec. 8, 1941.

Went ashore on the western coast of Sicily three weeks before the invasion. John was as much man as I've ever known.

Plumb tough around the edges and down the middle. Designed and built the infrastructure of his home town from 1946 to 1994, including personally building a square city block park with his own hands.

He was planning more improvements when he died, still on the city payroll. Donated his state retirement fund back to the city and continued working.

By your thinking, just another Old Fart living in the past --while building the future for others.

Ike left his WREN driver and made it home, because the promotion campaign to make his president was already underway and his "friends" wanted to give him a farm at Gettysburg.

Patton died after being relieved by Ike for speaking the truth about the Russians.

Actually Eduardo,

There is a great deal of detail and understanding to be found in the honest study of history. There used to be knowledge in daily news coverage, with Ernie Pyle, Bill Mauldin, Walter Kronkite, Edward R. Murrow, Kaltenborn and others. That was long before the Aussie Wetback, Ruppie Murdoch started his destruction of honest news coverage.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Mon, Apr 19, 2010, at 5:40 PM

Man, to be called stupid by Hank, now that really hurts.

How goes the program to sell underground houses to people in a earthquake zone?

-- Posted by boojum666 on Tue, Apr 20, 2010, at 9:25 PM

Eduardo,

In reality, Ike started me toward being a political independent.

A York County, PA customer invited me to climb his Harvestore silo. On top, he pointed out an open pasture beyond his land where dozens of new trucks were parked in rows across a pasture. The "Mid-Atlantic GM Truck Distributorship" out on a Pennsylvania pasture.

On Ike's Gettysburg farm. Ike's personal reward to turning over the U.S. Treasury to GM Chairman Charlie [GENERAL BULLMOOSE] Wilson.

I tried to convince myself this was an individual situation of GOP political corruption.

Then LBJ signed the Civil Rights Act and the lying, thieving, corrupt, RACIST DixieCrats bolted to be welcomed into the GOP.

That's when I became an Independent.

==================================

Of course, BooHoo, this Old Fart continues living in the past. Last night, sat with two county office challenger candidates who tried running clean, honest honorable campaigns the past three months and got royally hammered.

Both said they needed some way to win to make the run again.

Unfortunately, the Old Fart knew what was going to happen with two completely amateur campaigns.

Both candidates were great, their campaigns were pathetic.

Just told them to check their emails and the time my last email had been sent before reading it.

Yeah, it was transmitted 30 minutes before I left for their post-election party.

This morning came the first phone call.

"This will take a lot of work, organizing 200 neighborhood captains and getting three times as many voters to the polls as the total who voted yesterday. Can't we do this easier than how you laid it out?"

The only answer I could give, "Did you enjoy getting your butt handed to you last night?"

Yeah Boo, I'm living in the past.

I may not even be above ground in 2014 when they try again.

What's the gain for me?

Helping good people make this a better world after I'm gone.

Beats HELL out of sitting around moaning and groaning about this country being broke and those people I disagree with stealing my country from me.

It is a democratic, representative republic, People.

We have elections. Most local school board, city and county elections are won by the people who do the best job of organizing and learn to play hard ball.

Most beginners have some fantasy-world concept of how to campaign and win on merit. Up against a 20-year incumbent, they honestly believe their arguments and talking points will win.

BULL!!! Organizing and getting more votes cast will win. Not talk, not forums, not signs, not advertising -- organizing and getting your supporters to cast their votes.

But then, I'm just living in the past.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Wed, May 5, 2010, at 4:48 PM

NOT SO FAST EDUARDO --

Your Tea Leaf Readers just organized and controlled the Utah GOP nomination private caucus system, with fewer than 1,000 people.

Today, had a good old boy who was in one county meeting -- who is so mad he refuses to support his party.

Says the latest reincarnation of the John Birch Society moved in and took over.

"I've lived in this county 69 years and know every Republican by first name. These people waltzed in. The only person who seemed to know them was the delegate selection committee chairman running the meeting and he just ruled everyone present was entitled to vote -- county resident, registered voter in the county -- or not."

"It was Wham, Bam -- Don't bother to get up m'am. Meeting adjourned. We were in and out in 20 minutes, then hustled back out so they could close the building and once outside the security guard was waiting to lock the parking lot gate."

"Same thing happened in all the other counties I've checked with."

The proof is in the pudding. That approach to using totally unethical and illegal means to securing an election is not the right approach to organizing -- but it does show that organizing, delivering the votes and controlling an election with the most votes -- works.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Thu, May 13, 2010, at 12:24 AM

Fast Eduardo,

How did this blog move from your buddy Nostradamus' predictin NU and MU in the Big 10 turned Twelve.

Whoops.

-- Posted by HerndonHank on Thu, May 13, 2010, at 12:26 AM


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